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scaling sliceforms

MeowMeow Member Posts: 584
Is it possible to rescale sliceforms in MTC?  I read somewhere that rescaling sliceforms doesn't work well because it messes up the slots.

Comments

  • Crazy_Mr_ZingCrazy_Mr_Zing Member Posts: 3,198
    When you scale a slice form the width of the slots change
    whether this causes issues depends on how much you scale by

    the way I over come this was to change the slots to a single line at the mid point of each slot - scale - then create the slots using shadows of those lines

    I guess you might be able to eye ball it But "I don't do eyeballing" LOL

    The follow is based on all the shapes with the slot vertically 

    I used node edit to remove the left and top of each slot and also break the node at the bottom of the right line
    perform a break


    Select all those right lines perform a join then reduce X position half the slot width






    while all the lines are still selected extend the line so they extend outside the shape outlines

    use the pencil close the gap so each shape outline is a closed path
    select each shape outline and perform a join

    select all and resize proportionally to the desired size

    create shadows of those lines choose blackout and mitre to create rectangle sized the required width of the slot


    discard the lines

    perform a Boolean join between the shape outlines and the shadows


    I Use Zing Air, Make The Cut - Pop Card Studio, WinXP- Win7 -Win10
    Paper Modellers I Revere Marc Hagan-Guirey ----- Yoshinobu Miyamoto ----- Peter Dahmen
    Gallery ID #26944 ----- Link to My Cloud Have a Look your Welcome to Make Use of the Files
  • MeowMeow Member Posts: 584
    edited February 15
    @Crazy_Mr_Zing ;
      Thank you.  What I am wanting to do is to rescale the free cupcake sliceform from extremepapercrafting website.    I have brought it into MTC.  I will attach the file.    What I want to do is shorten it vertically so that it looks like a pie and use it to make a card like the cherry pie card from Lovepop cards.  I will attach the Lovepop link.  I wondered if after selecting I could just take the top arrow and drag it downward to make each piece shorter so that it looks like a pie instead of a cupcake.  Wouldn't that just shorten the slots or would it change the width of them too?

    Lovepop link:
    https://www.lovepopcards.com/products/cherry-pie-pop-up-card?variant=17104957633
  • Crazy_Mr_ZingCrazy_Mr_Zing Member Posts: 3,198
    if your only changing the height and the slots are vertical the slot width should not change

    select all and drag the top down to resize only in the vertical direction
    ensure

    you could use node editing to amputate the cherry
    leave the slot intact
    close the path with the pencil to create a rectangle


    then use boolean join to create the slot in the pie top




    I Use Zing Air, Make The Cut - Pop Card Studio, WinXP- Win7 -Win10
    Paper Modellers I Revere Marc Hagan-Guirey ----- Yoshinobu Miyamoto ----- Peter Dahmen
    Gallery ID #26944 ----- Link to My Cloud Have a Look your Welcome to Make Use of the Files
  • MeowMeow Member Posts: 584
    @Crazy_Mr_Zing what is the recommended width of a slot in a sliceform?  I am learning to use Sketchup and just made my first sliceform with it.  When I imported the SVG file into MTC, I noticed that the slot width on my y direction slices is smaller than that on my x direction slices. I thought I would just edit it in MTC but I don't know which slots to edit.  I am attaching the file.
  • CharoCharo Member Posts: 678
    @Crazy_Mr_Zing your method of changing the slices to a single line before resizing the shapes is genius!  I have been re-doing them all.  What a time saver.
    @Meow I am very impressed you have figured out Sketchup.  I just can't understand it so am still attempting to make slice forms on my own.  Some times success most times not....  On slice width I have been using .02 which is what Leslie6111 recommended and it has worked well for me.

    Member 30818
  • MeowMeow Member Posts: 584
    edited February 16
    @Charo Thank you so much for that info. Do you mean .02 mm or .02 inches? I am just hacking away at Sketchup. My construction of it in Sketchup was not perfect. When I brought it into MTC, there were a lot of hidden dots and lines that came in that I had to delete. It crashed my MTC. I decided it was the computer so I went to a different one and it didn't crash, but it was verrrryyy slow until I got all the deleting done. I am still working on it.
  • CharoCharo Member Posts: 678
    @Meow well I guess I don't know!  The place where you set the width and length of shapes is where I enter .02 and I am not sure if it is inches or mm.  I know under node editing everything is in mm.
    Member 30818
  • MeowMeow Member Posts: 584
    @Charo thanks.  I will look at it once I set it and see what it looks like.  
  • Crazy_Mr_ZingCrazy_Mr_Zing Member Posts: 3,198
    edited February 17
    My non expert thoughts on slot width is it dependant of the thickness of the material you using and also if your make a standing model where the slots should be quite a close fit or a fold flat where they need to be a little looser to allow a little movement

    It been quite some time since I play with sketchup
    I not sure if the extension is working differently with the later version of sketchup or i have a different version of slice5 ?

    flattened shapes the slice5 extension creates are no flat 2d shape they have thickness equal to the thickness setting



    so all the little pieces are the sides face of the 3d shape


    I've been playing with a extension named selection toys 
    https://sketchucation.com/pluginstore?pln=tt_selection_toys

    to select only the top face and export
    not sure if there another way but it works for me

    create the flattened slices using slice5 extension

    select both groups of flattened shapes
    right click explode and then again right click explode
    click off the shape to deselect all
    click on the top face of one of the shapes
    right click use the select toys "select" menu item > coplanar faces



    all the top face of the shapes should now have be select selected

    right click export to svg


    regard your file recheck the setting you've used and the x and y thickness is the same
    I think maybe this is because the shape you working with has different Y and X dimensions
    what were your settings in the slice5 extension?
    I not sure what some do
    I've not fully read the documentation https://sketchucation.com/plugin/781-tig_slicer

    Post edited by Crazy_Mr_Zing on
    I Use Zing Air, Make The Cut - Pop Card Studio, WinXP- Win7 -Win10
    Paper Modellers I Revere Marc Hagan-Guirey ----- Yoshinobu Miyamoto ----- Peter Dahmen
    Gallery ID #26944 ----- Link to My Cloud Have a Look your Welcome to Make Use of the Files
  • leslie6111leslie6111 Member Posts: 2,360
    edited February 17
    I kind of do things like Paul does that he described above. When I want to change the size of sliceforms, I grab all the slices and then change them all at once in x and y . In many cases you just have to redo the slots cause in the new size they change uniformly with the change in shape. Then I stack the the slices.  I line up the new thin overlapping rectangles to make the new slots over where the old ones were.  Then I remove the slots from the slices and close their shapes so that I can redo them with the boolean join method as Paul outlines above with the thin rectangles. It is just a lot of grunt work.
  • MeowMeow Member Posts: 584
    edited February 17
    @leslie6111 and @Crazy_Mr_Zing thanks so much.  I just discovered the explode function yesterday which allowed me to separate the shapes from each other, but I did not realize if I used it again that I could just select the top face.  I thought I had set the thickness to the same, but I may not have.  It was the first time I had used slicer5.  Whew!! Doing sliceforms is intense.  On one set of my slices the width of the slots was 0.03 but on the slices in the other direction it was .06.  I fixed them in MTC.  I also had to change some of the slots to the opposite sides of the pieces so they would interlock. I haven't cut it yet.  I will be holding by breath before I do that in hopes it will fit together well.  
  • Crazy_Mr_ZingCrazy_Mr_Zing Member Posts: 3,198
    I can't really get my head around the grouping in sketchup
    I tend to just try things until this work
    I watched a few introduction to sketchup videos on utube that got me starter but still visualising in 3d is quite difficult

    I also was thinking about swapping the slots to  other side so form was held together
     
    The tricky part is swapping the correct ones 1, so they other pieces match and 2, so its still possible to assemble

    I recall a lovepop manger popup card someone was try to recreate on the forum
    I created a version myself oh boy did I get in a tangle with alternating slots

    I spend hours yesterday trying to get the slice5  Slotter function to work
    as i understand it you create the xy slices with no slots
    then you can move the slices in the 3d model and then the slotter function should create the slots based on the rearranged model ?
    I never figured it out


    I Use Zing Air, Make The Cut - Pop Card Studio, WinXP- Win7 -Win10
    Paper Modellers I Revere Marc Hagan-Guirey ----- Yoshinobu Miyamoto ----- Peter Dahmen
    Gallery ID #26944 ----- Link to My Cloud Have a Look your Welcome to Make Use of the Files
  • MeowMeow Member Posts: 584
    edited February 18
    @Crazy_Mr_Zing that was me you helped reproduce the manger card.  I am super pleased with it.   I learn in a similar way.     I do a lot of praying that I will understand, watch a few videos, come here to this forum for help, and hack away.  I am working on reproducing one LovePop's turtle sliceform cards.  I have my turtle sliceform done except it need to be scaled down in size.  I am going to use your method of scaling that you described above.    I used Sketchup to make the sliceform.  It was not perfect but I got it close enough.  Then I imported the slices into MTC and fixed some of the problems I did not know how to fix in Sketchup.   I moved some of my slots to opposite sides so they would interlock.  However, I can't figure out how to attach a tab to one of the turtle slices so that when I anchor it to the card the slit I place the tab in will be parallel  to the fold of the card.  I have been under the impression that the slit the tab is placed in  to anchor it to the card had to be parallel to the fold line in the card, but  I came across this card from a site called CharmPop whose tab anchor is not parallel to the fold.  I am attaching the picture of their sliceform that is attached to a card.  Hmmmmm....I never thought that would work.  I am going to see if my turtle sliceform will work that way before I go to the trouble of figuring out how to attach a tab that is parallel.
  • Crazy_Mr_ZingCrazy_Mr_Zing Member Posts: 3,198
    I think the anchors can be on a angle the form would then fold up a bit like a v fold popup  rather than fold squarely it would fold and pivot

    I have to think a little maybe each slot would have to be a right angle to the other ?
    or oposing angles for the center fold ?

    it maybe be easier to build the form then glue the tabs later

    many of those popup card use string to anchor 2 diagonal corners and that allows for a twisting movement

    I recall a member that was from a card producer from Vietnam link a video demonstrating how the positioned the string anchors

    there are quite a few video showing these maker cards opening




    I Use Zing Air, Make The Cut - Pop Card Studio, WinXP- Win7 -Win10
    Paper Modellers I Revere Marc Hagan-Guirey ----- Yoshinobu Miyamoto ----- Peter Dahmen
    Gallery ID #26944 ----- Link to My Cloud Have a Look your Welcome to Make Use of the Files
  • MeowMeow Member Posts: 584
    @Crazy_Mr_Zing thanks for that video. I noticed there is a piece hooked between the front legs and the back legs. Is that there for stability?
  • Crazy_Mr_ZingCrazy_Mr_Zing Member Posts: 3,198
    yes those crosspieces help the mechanism work without it the 2 diagonal leg the are anchor may just bend rather than push the form flat
    I Use Zing Air, Make The Cut - Pop Card Studio, WinXP- Win7 -Win10
    Paper Modellers I Revere Marc Hagan-Guirey ----- Yoshinobu Miyamoto ----- Peter Dahmen
    Gallery ID #26944 ----- Link to My Cloud Have a Look your Welcome to Make Use of the Files
  • leslie6111leslie6111 Member Posts: 2,360
    edited February 18
    You would have to merge a rectangle to make a tab in one left side front leg and one right side back leg. In a normal popup, also the corresponding cross slice would be tabbed, but since this sliceform in the video is just a slotted crosspiece, I do think it is necessary and the legs should be sufficient to open the popup when the card opens. In the chick sliceform, the grass is tabbed, but the chick is glued onto the grass so when the grass is opened so is the chick. The grass would be tabbed at both the cross pieces at - hard to say in words - front left and back right with their corresponding cross pieces.
  • MeowMeow Member Posts: 584
    @leslie6111 thank you.  There is so much to learn.  I am thankful that so many here are willing to help me.  I got the crosspieces done and have scaled down the sliceform.  Now I am working on the widths of the slots using the method Crazy_Mr_Zing described.  
  • cpeepcpeep Member Posts: 137
    Or you could email the designer of the cupcake (me) and ask me to rescale it. ;)

     I usually keep a (digital) copy of the initial sketches with the slots still separate objects, allowing for relatively straightforward redrawing.
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